See more rational trip reports by anonymous readers for: 2C-B, 4-AcO-DMT, LSD, N,N-DMT, 5-MeO-DMT
- Restfulness: Well-Rested (7-8 hours of sleep)
- Wake-up time: 5:10 am
- Morning run: 5:30 am (~30 minutes total)
- Breakfast time: 9:25 am
- Food: 2 chicken sausages + ½ bagel, ¾ can of Peach-Pear La Croix (carbonation will create a slightly acidic environment, possibly potentiating drug’s metabolism)
- Weight: 55-60 kg
- Height: 170-180 cm
- Sex / Identity / Orientation: Male / Cis / Hetero
- Libido: decently high; 2 days since last masturbation
- Dosage: 6 g, mostly caps; took 2x dosage of everyone else to prevent any potential short-term homeostatic adaptive effects which might lead to upping dosage mid-stride
- Other Drugs: none
- Temperature: moderately warm – cozy (~ 74 F, 23 C)
- Light: near window with ample filtered sunlight
- Touch: sitting on fuzzy carpet; comfortable loose-fitting athleisure wear clothes
- Olfactory: 5 sprays of peach-nectarine body scent (as an experiment to test memory retrieval of trip, as unlike other sensory systems, scent mostly bypasses the thalamic sensory gating filter)
- Taste: regular mushroom taste, 2 Listerine strips immediately afterward (again to engage in potential memory retrieval). Nothing nauseating or stomach-troubling.
- Auditory: listening to minimalist / contemporary classical music by Ludovico Einaudi
- Visual: YouTube videos of fractal images & Islamic art
- Social: 4 friends (3 of which are of the rationalist-tribe; all techies)
Prior Cognitive State
- Past drug experiences: 2 occasions of cannabis, few times alcohol, and 2 occasions of adderall. All minor experiences, none negative, and generally I strongly abstain from psychoactive drugs (even caffeine). No prior experience with psychedelics(!)
- Mood: relatively optimistic and happy; no negative feelings
- Beliefs: generally Fictionalist in ontology, though in recent years have experienced Platonist tendencies. Strongly grounded in an empirically-based, scientific-physicalist perspective. Strong sense of individuality + Selfhood. Not religious, nor spiritual, though upbringing was Roman Catholic.
- Training: former academic neuroscience + pharmacologically-trained; current data science graduate student
- Goals: to gain first-person experience of Klüver constants and re-establish/confirm any potential taxonomy of geometric forms (see here, here, and here for more)
- Expectations: extremely skeptical that any fantastical effects might occur other than some random colors in the visual field, minor mood changes, minor memory + time effects such as retarded / slowed time, and maybe at most some Alice-in-Wonderland Syndrome perceptual-type effects. Hoping for experiences of strong and consistent + clearly defined Klüver constants, but skeptical they even exist. Skeptical of any notion of god-minds, communion with nature, dying and being reborn, and generally any spiritual or mystical experiences.
Real-Time Trip Report (unedited)
Time of Ingestion – 9:55 am, 02/15/2020
10:21 – First noticeable effect. Concentration lagging. Palms beginning to sweat. Starting to feel like it might be difficult to focus enough to write a report.
10:29 – REALLY strong physiological effect. Losing focus. Similar to being extremely tired(!). Sweat increasing (palms, pits, neck in that order). No visual or auditory hallucinations yet. Everyone else is laughing somewhat uncontrollably.
10:33 – First STRONG spike of losing concentration. Similar to being really tired or fainting.
10:36 – Another strong spike of losing consciousness. No hallucinations yet.
10:37 – Spike again. Increasing frequency now. One about every 15-20 seconds. Have to write this sentence in bursts, and memory is trying to keep up recovering my train of thought. Have to stop and now and then to
10:38 – First visual effectss! Tortoise shell-like fractal images. Hard to focus. Palms really really really sweaty, notice it as keyboard residue.
10:43 – Still hanging in there. Notice that friend’s response time is really late with around 2 minute delayss, not sure if that’s me or them? Extreme switching cost now between chrome tabs of writing and watching youtube vid.
10:46 – Switching cost too strong. Dilemma now between 3rd person documentation and 1st person immersion. Trying hrad.
10:47 – okay giving in to the experience now. too strong now
10:48 – laughter
10:48 does not make sense, really hard to type now, losing languge
50 trying hard to document. worried hwo to convey this
51 realizati not abot documnting 52 thats it 53 can i come back
54 latice structs 58 still here k
Total Trip Duration: ~6-7 hours
I’m writing this now being fully recovered and in my usual frame of mind. I’m going to start with how much I can remember…
Somewhat cognizant but before peak experience, I came back from one of my blackouts and saw one of my friends outside the cabin. I worried about their safety but realized that other people were going to take care of him. I also remember one of my friends constantly checking up on me. The strongest thought that I recall during the beginning of my experience was realizing that I had to let go of all this documentation, stop worrying about others and what other people think, and had to let go of this 3rd person perspective. I know this sounds somewhat monstrously misanthropic, but at the time of the experience I felt like that to pursue Truth I had to go further than everyone else even if that meant leaving them behind, and it was distracting to even have to jump back and forth between 1st and 3rd person perspective to focus on responding to other people during my brief moments of sanity to tell them I was ok when I could be delving deeper and deeper into the experience. This thought of leaving all thoughts of others behind to pursue the Truth reoccurred a few times as I began to get sucked into the vortex of patterns found in the wood grains of the floor and the curls of the carpet.
Linearity of experience was soon lost. I blinked in and out of existence. Time was definitely not unraveling like the constant forward stream I was used to and I felt like I was teleporting from one false reality to the next. I didn’t know in what order those events occurred. At this period I really wasn’t thinking, but more just passively viewing brief glimpses and snapshots of my body going through the motion. One moment I was in the kitchen. The next locked in the bathroom. The next on the living room floor. It’s such a shame that there’s a quirk in our language requiring me to express these as “next experiences” when in reality I did not experience them as having an order. I felt a really strong sense of déjà vu and reverse déjà vu tied to each of them, as if I’ve already done them before while also simultaneously knowing that I will be doing them in the future. It was really weird to have the feeling that you know you’ve already lived the future.
I blinked onto the bathroom floor. I thought why should I even look back and respond at all to the other people asking if I was okay when I finally have the chance to explore and find Truth with a capital T, and suddenly a strong sadness hit me. It was more of a feeling than a coherent logical thought, but the best way I can explain it was that it was a type of guilt that I’ll never be able to share this with my sister, my brother, my mom and dad, and then what will happen to my roommates, and then all my other friends and classmates around me, and how they’ll worry about me and so I told myself I’ll have to come back for them.
And so I tried to come back. Trying and wanting is such an interesting concept. It’s weird to desire language without being able to form a coherent line of thought or internal sentence in your head, but that is what I remember doing. How do you say to yourself that you want something without even being able to describe to yourself what that is? It seems desire may be more fundamental than internal language. Soon my linguistic centers began to reboot and I realized that this had to do with my memory chunks getting larger and allowing me to hold more in short term memory. Although seemingly primitive and simplistic, I can’t emphasize enough how this realization that memory and language were intertwined and recursively bootstrapping each other really helped soothe away any panic that I was totally lost.
I blinked into the kitchen. Time was becoming more linearly coherent now, but I kept blanking out and teleporting randomly throughout the kitchen. The thing was: I didn’t think of it as the same kitchen. I thought of it as different parallel realities of a kitchen that I recognize. I remember my friend offering me a chip and me trying so very hard to grasp that chip from her and hold on to that reality even if it was not the true real one, as if by merely believing by sheer force of will that I am actually grasping an object then made it concrete. I recall saying ‘trying to parse’. I strained with cognitive effort to stop teleporting. I remember asking everyone in each reality I blinked into whether or not this was the real one. “Wow, is this real?” became a repeating question tinted with wonder and surprise.
I blinked into the living room. Time was linear again, and it seems I began to be able to somewhat coherently reflect on the geometric patterns clouding my sight. I regretfully wished I could have focused on them more (as well as the apparently living, pulsating, and breathing floor beneath me and the shrinking and growing of my hands), but it was at this moment that I truly to the deep core of myself had the gut feeling that this reality wasn’t my original one. I honestly and wholeheartedly believed that this reality was a construct and that I was living out a simulation either in the mind of my true body in the real world (where I was probably in some coma in the hospital) or inhabiting the body of a different version of myself in a parallel universe. Everything felt false. Fake. Simulated. I was overcome with a Great Sadness that I didn’t know how to get back to my own original reality, and that I never said goodbye to the people I loved. And I was surprised because these melancholic emotions were of such strength to overcome my scientific training and any previous skepticism I once held.
I tried in vain to remember some mathematical way of proving you were living in a simulation, maybe something from information theory, or Tegmark’s mathematical universe, or something regarding speeds and frames of references and computational power being limited in an embedded simulated universe, but I could not for the life of me recall how to actually prove this to myself or what experiment to run. I remember, fuck man, I really should have worked out those thought experiments and proofs in depth because now I’m stuck.
However, it was on that thought of frames of references that I realized with some sadness and regret that maybe it’s not all that bad since how can I be the one to say one reality is more real and valid than the next? The best way I can convey this was that it was a somewhat mono no aware-type feeling. Even if this is a simulation in my mind or I’m in some parallel universe, why should I be any less happy? If someone spent their whole life creating their own meaning through something as removed from reality as art, or music, or pure math, and was able to live a fulfilling life, why should any particular version of myself be considered less meaningful just because this version of me possesses a memory of another me as an origin and potential branching-off point? Wasn’t another reality just as valid as the original one that I just came from? What made my old frame of reference special except for the mere fact of it being my origin? Why was I feeling this sense of sadness that I left it all behind to teleport to this version of reality? And then came the acceptance that if this reality was just as real except for my gut belief that it wasn’t, why shouldn’t I be able to simultaneously accept that gut feeling and move on and live in this version of reality?
And so I decided to live on, and within a few hours began to lose this sense that this was the false reality (although I really really wished I had a GoPro camera with me so that I could definitively prove to myself that I was in the correct reality). I began to have a newfound strong sense of empathy towards people with dissociative disorders. Thinking back on the experience, I think I primed myself for these thoughts when I kept switching between first-person and third-person perspectives, telling myself I couldn’t handle the switching cost any longer and that I should just immerse myself fully in the experience and forget about documenting this for other people, and why was I even submitting myself to the approval of others anyways because if there’s anyone who will have to go further in their exploration and sacrifice the chance to be with others then I guess I’ll just have to take up that burden.
Overall, I think the strong dissociative experience of thinking this reality was the fake simulated one had to do with maybe a couple of things. As mentioned before, one cause could have been the psychological priming induced by constantly switching between 1st and 3rd person ways of perceiving this event, creating the necessary emotional conditions of being simultaneously split between existing and being fully immersed in the present moment versus wanting to abstract / detach myself from the moment.
The second potential cause of the dissociation could have been due to my brain constantly blacking out and being rebooted in another physical part of the house. Because I had no memory of the continuity of how I got from one context to the next, this conditioned my brain to rationalize and register each separate event as a separate reality, probably falsely recognizing and incorrectly pattern matching these experiences as being more similar to a dream state where teleportation is normal, perceptions are distorted, and sequences of events are jumbled. This probably then began synthesizing the necessary eventual gut-belief that this reality was fake (because I subconsciously falsely pattern matched that it was similar to a dream).
Finally, I think the third potential contributor to the dissociation occurred when I was coming down from the experience and my brain went on overdrive trying to rationalize events. It might be possible that the more you are adept at creatively rationalizing things away the paradoxically worse you are at accepting this reality. Just having knowledge of potential parallel realities in physics, the simulation hypothesis that we might either be simulated in our heads or on a computer and may not realize it, the philosophy of solipsism, and knowing the neuroscience of how just freaking good the brain is at tricking itself that something is real, all created fertile conditions for my brain to interpret this reality as false.
Thinking back on the experience, I now have a newfound appreciation for memory and the continuity of experience, and their contribution to what it means to feel situated and embodied in this reality. If I were to do this again I would probably micro-dose so that I could still retain my linguistic faculties and linear way of reasoning in order to investigate the visual geometric effects in much greater scientific 3rd person POV-like rigor, focusing less on the semantic psychoanalytical content of the experience and more on the psychophysical optical effects (which was my original goal!). This really showed me how dependent the sense of Self was on the continuity of memory and experience and that maybe the Self really is composed of different smaller frames of reference generated by subnetworks in the brain (and hence is an ecology of momentary and brief snapshots / selves constantly going in and out of existence, both competing and coalescing in dynamic flux to make up the whole Self). Without the strong pillar that the continuity of singular memory provides to the host body that this community of selves inhabits, I think there really could be a binding problem for integrating these individual snapshots into a singular Selfhood and individual identity that persist through time that we call ‘I’.
Overall, I gained a much greater appreciation for continuity, the linear narrative of language intertwined with memory, and what it feels like on the inside of someone who is dissociated and thinks their surrounding reality is just a construct and not real. Also, the geometric images were really cool and I finally now understand why people say Google’s DeepDream art seems psychedelic, because looking into the mirror during the later stages of my trip confirmed that my face really did look like a globular, eyes-everywhere, and skewed proportioned / sized image!
Anyways, I really want to thank my friends that were with me on this trip and for constantly checking up on me to make sure I was okay. Rarely do I feel comfortable in the presence of other people and I’m glad I felt safe with you.
Thank you ❤️
Overall, I’d give my first experience with psychedelics a 7/10!
2-Week Post-Trip Report
So it’s been 2 weeks since ingestion and I just wanted to briefly report this one last interesting phenomenon for documentation’s sake.
Out of the 14 days post-trip, a little less than half of those nights (6 nights in total, distributed more heavily in the week immediately after the trip), I’ve had dreams that featured strongly self-referential phenomena. Within these dreams, my perceptual surroundings immediately reminded me of my aforementioned psychonautical experience of questioning my reality. These strong emotional realizations would then essentially cause my brain to kick itself out of the dream.
However, instead of truly waking up, I was still nested inside another dream in which I was imagining waking up. I usually went through 2-3 rounds of this false waking-up cycle until I finally surfaced into the real reality of the morning.
I thought it interesting for the first 2 nights, but after that it actually got really tiring always waking up questioning whether or not I’m really awake, and then having to go through the same motions of prepping for school/work knowing you’ve done that 2-3 times already in your head for the day.
What was funny though was that this always occurred around the same time each morning (my body has always naturally woken up at 5 am on the dot since high school), and in each iteration of the dream in which I falsely woke up I remember looking at my clock and seeing that it is 5 am. This would then lend me false-confidence and confirm that “ah, ok, I’m not in the dream anymore since I really do wake up at 5 am“. However, I think after enough times of this not working my brain finally came to learn that that was no longer a reliable indicator of the reality being real.
This skeptical realization finally got strong enough to be able to recall within my dream and act as an early kick-out mechanism that I eventually woke up closer and closer to my true ‘waking up point’. I remember going through the wake-up, look at the clock, remember that this no longer works, then immediately get kicked out, and wake up again, look at the clock, then remember this no longer works and get kicked out again, wake up, then look at the clock and finally get some inkling that this perception is a little different and realize that’s because I’m really waking up for real now. A rather fascinating experience!
Featured image by Nick Swanson
I think the reporter will indeed find microdosing an interesting addition to meditation
I also found this trip report a very worthwhile read. Seeing that the author professed a large skepticism towards mystic experiences at the outset, I thought that the reported experiences themselves were quite mystic indeed. I particularly like the formulation of moving towards the Truth with a capital T. It’s simply that the experience was parsed through the mind of someone who had engaged a lot with simulation theories rather than say Christian theology. But in my view, when it comes to mystic stuff, that’s mostly a difference in maps, rather than in territory (or maybe I should say that the scientific world-view historically failed to provide a useful map, something that places like this blog are working towards rectifying). In truth, most (and certainly the best) mystic descriptions should be treated as poetry that, like all poetry, try to convey the sense of an experience.
As a second point, in Tibetan dream yoga, they advise you to look at your waking life as if you were dreaming. I.e. internalise in every moment that you don’t experience the external world per se, but rather only ever experience a representation of the external world created by your mind. Insofar it’s like Platos allegory of the cave. In addition you have “internal” experiences like thoughts, hunger, bliss, the feeling of self etc. – of course they are nothing but fabrications of the mind either. The point is that everything you’ll ever experience is a fabrication of your own mind. I think psychedelic experiences really drive this point home. Your internal and external experiences change so quickly and dramatically, in such unusual ways or disappear outright that it’s easier to see that through your external senses, you don’t experience objective reality as it is, but only your mind’s representation of the outside (that hopefully represents external reality in a reliable and useful manner when you’re not on drugs). In the same vein, it becomes easier to see internal phenomena as conditioned, e.g. per the examples given in the report, that language is reliant on memory or that the sense of self is a constantly changing process.
I think that adopting such a perspective of “every moment is like a dream in that I only ever experience fabrications of my mind” also makes it easier to relax during a trip. It makes you worry less about whether an experience is “real” or not or if, as in the report here, you wonder if you are still in “your” universe. The feeling of being lost in a foreign universe is another passing sensation fabricated by your mind. If it’s all in your head anyway, why make a fuss rather than just enjoying (or sometimes suffering through) the ride? Mono no aware indeed.
Poetry – I entirely agree
@Jan – I really like the view of treating *every moment like a dream and that everything is a fabrication of my mind*. I definitely agree that for many people this might soothe away any concerns, especially during a trip. Could we perhaps be losing something through this perspective though? What if we are throwing out any potential use that might come about through *ranking different moments according to their level of realness*? Maybe treating every moment as a fabrication and completely leveling the field is just a way of dealing with our emotional reaction towards complete loss of orientation (with respect to where we are in our reality ranking scheme) and might not be helpful outside the emotional use-case?
I agree. I look at this from a basically Buddhist perspective where there is a distinction between what is called the absolute and the relative level of reality (you might also call this absolute and relative perspectives on experience). The absolute level says “every experience is a fabrication (no exceptions)” while the relative level says “yeah but it’s still useful to relate to different things differently if you’re at all interested in what your experiences will be like”.
In this framework, any ranking of “levels of realness” would take place at the relative level. You might say seeing an apple because it is physically in front of you is more real than seeing an apple that is an hallucination entirely.* That would be a useful distinction on the relative level. But at the same time you might also explore how the experience of seeing the hallucination of an apple is similar to seeing a “real” apple, how both experiences are constructed by your brain – fabrications at the absolute level. The same goes for any other experience you might have. Both a relative and an absolute perspective are often useful and it can be interesting to explore what happens when you emphasise one perspective over the other.
*Personally, I wouldn’t say that an experience is more or less real, but rather ask questions like: Do I think that this sensation represents physical reality accurately? If I experience fear, why do I think that fear arose? Did it arise because there is something I should be afraid of? When there is the impression that I’m somehow not in “my” universe anymore, do I think that this impression implies truth? For thoughts, do I think that this thought is useful and true? Mind you, during a trip many of this questions might be asked and the answer felt on a sub-lingual level, some questions might be impossible to answer or even to ask.
I approved the other comment – let me know if you prefer I approve this one instead.
You’re good…you can delete this one. Thanks!
Cool, thanks 🙂
I found this absolutely fascinating, and given that I don’t have any safe way to experience this by myself, Im really grateful that I can get at least this glimpse.
Also I disagree completely from the previous comment, I found the approach perfect.
It probably depends what you are looking for!
It is interesting that this trip report ascribes no “meaning” to anything other than the factual and almost scientific. He is trying to work out the nature of the self, which is all well and good. But somehow he can not seem to find any deeper meaning here. Of course perhaps there is none. Perhaps he was not looking for it. He takes a very reductionist view and that of course is his prerogative. Perhaps he is “right” to do that. Personally I would have sought (and probably found) more from the experience. But then that is my disposition – to look for meaning and purpose where none may exist.